A new community funding mechanism


#21

this is absolutely spot on. if we do this then btcz will become ‘just another alt
coin’. its our strong principles on decentralisation (true spirit of btc) that makes btcz the most unique altcoin.

fee - amounts voluntarily paid for some service or goods
tax - a payment imposed and to be controlled by an ‘authority’ (even if elected authority)

i support dev tax on fees (where say % of kioskz/txtz or other app fees get donated to community fund) - the dev in charge of the app decides what to do with his own app

i dont support tax (this is actually a mining tax, not a dev tax) on btcz itself. its not decentralisation of currency.


#22

yyyZ in our case , there is a Community.
It is not a specific program/app.
The Community has a whole ecosystem and some expenses to sustain it and expand it.

It is oxymoron saying that you understand a dev tax which is put without asking you like in Zcash , but you don’t agree with a Community fee which is the ONLY way for a fair distribution of the funding weight to all the community members.
For example it is not logical to have 50 members working hard AND donating for every need of the BTCZ and 2000 miners/dumpers enjoying the ASIC resistance or the ultra speed of btcz in suprnova without having paid a single cent for the Community.
With this minor Community fee , the balance and the justice of our funding mechanism can be restored and the Project can be much safer with better future outlook.


#23

I’m sorry, what does it means?
Let’s say I have 1,000 BTCZ, then with a Community Fee of 3%, someone at charge of the source code of the project will be able to take 30 BTCZ from my wallet, because the voting to Yes was majority?


#24

I recommend 5% to developers.


#25

@donlaiq nah it says your further income will be 3% less, but try to look further. This means you tipped BitcoinZ automatically, its like a monthly bill for our services what you voted for (or devoted for).
You decide! You decived how much! You decide to stop.
It will all going to back our hands (community fund).
You decide where to spend it!
Right it will decrease the circulation supply by “3%” or whatever percentage we vote, but thats mean people gonna think twice before dumping it. It will be in usecase so it will get back to market after a certain time (, successful votes of usecases).
So overall its a price and fund riser activity for faster improvements.


#26

I believe we should have 10% minimum (25% ideally), lets face it we all rather have 75-90% of something than 100% of …


#27

fee - amounts voluntarily paid for some service or goods

Gotta say otherwise to that.

If it’s voluntary, it’s a donation, not a fee.

If fees were voluntary, TicketBastard would have no business model.

Nor would credit card companies!


#28

No, it does not mean that at all. Nothing in your wallet today will be taken from it. There is no substitute for actually reading the proposal! If you’ve read it and don’t understand it, then please ask specifically about what you don’t understand.


#29

Spreadsheet time again …

Here are the daily, weekly, and monthly amounts of BTCZ that would be raised for the Community Fund at various fee rates (tax rates) on the current creation pace of 7.2 m BTCZ per day.

This is looking forward to the 2nd phase of the question (i.e. “What should the rate be?”), which of course only applies if the first phase of the question passes.

If we get there this info will be coped to the new proposal, but I do think it has some relevance already in the sense that thinking about this question at all requires forming some notion of what amount of funding could/should become available to accomplish the multiple purposes to which the Community Fund would be applied.


#30

No more poor community, after vault Z. We can pay for new exchanges, new projects and ETC… That’s cool idea!


#31

Thanks for your answer. One more thing. I don’t get it yet. This fee will be applied for every transaction in the blockchain or will be just aimed to the miners?
If the first option is applied who will pay for it, the buyer or the the seller?


#32

The btcz transaction fees will not change.
The fee will be applied in the mining process so everyone will contribute with an automated % percentage from the block distribution rewards


#33

Will historical transactions and balances available for everyone (member and non-member) to view anytime they wish?


#34

I would say 5% is a good figure to have 10.8M of coins collected by month.


#35

Fantastic proposal my friend! I hope it can be implemented shortly.


#36

In my opinion the % for the fund should be higher - minimum 12000 - 500 ratio if not higher. A lot of people are working their as*es off to create smith good.

10% should be ideal!


#37

with current prices that would give us 2 BTC a month, thats enough for some movement.


#38

If this current proposal-in-concept passes (and it seems to be doing quite well so far), I suggest that the next vote to make it more specific could go like this:

Please vote for one of:

Small fee:   3% or 6%

Medium fee:  12% or 15%

Large fee:  20, or 25%

The first round of voting will eliminate one of these categories.
Low vote getter is kaput!

Everyone will get to vote again in a 2nd round.
Again, low vote getter is kaput!

The final round of voting will determine which of the two numbers in the remaining category becomes the winner.   (Most votes wins.)

A separate vote can be held to decide whether the percentage is revoted on either 1 or 2 years hence.

#39

In the spreadsheet above I’ve highlighted in green the 14% line.

This would put just over 1,000,000 BTCZ per day into the Community Fund.
At today’s approximate value of 1 BTCZ = 10 satoshis of BTC, that’s .1 BTC per day, or @ $640 per day.

That’s just over 30,000,000 BTCZ per month, or 300m satoshis of BTC per month, or $19200 per month.

I suggest thinking along the lines of this being the minimum amount to raise - not a soda straw (too little), not a tsunami (too much), but perhaps a fire-hose of decent strength that can be pointed where it will be highly useful, again and again.

If we do get to the next round with this proposal, and if we should vote on low/medium/high as I suggest, then I personally will be voting for high, because I think the high option would have the optimal best effect for the coin and all it’s participants.

The medium option, IMO, would be enough to matter, to make a real positive difference (but not as much as we could make).

The low option, IMO, would be a drop in-the-bucket - simply not enough to make a difference.

IMO, taking 1m or even 2m per-day (out of 7.2m) off of the exchanges will have strong dual advantages of

a) lowering daily supply-to-market (lowering total so-called “dumping”) enough to at least assist a rise in price from the supply/demand POV

b) providing a Community Fund of substantial enough size to really get some things done!

To have fun with the old saying - “A million BTCZ here, a million BTCZ there - pretty soon you’re talking about real money!”.

So, let’s get real!!


#40

I think of it this way:

There are two different groups that we wish to be able to motivate via the Community Fund to do good things for the coin -

A) crypto-saavy believers

B) those who need to be paid in fiat (like because rent and food!) in exchange for their goods/services/time, etc.

Group A knows about the costs and time required for mining, how long it takes to accumulate coin by mining, and how rare is the opportunity to accumulate significant (e.g. 1m or more) coin other than by buying it with fiat on exchanges (via the complicated process and risk that entails).

Anyone in Group A should be highly motivatable by the Community Fund’s ability to reward them for days or weeks of work with an amount of coin that would otherwise take a large investment (of fiat) and a long time (many months, or even > 1 year) to accumulate by any other method.

Group B is any person or company (service provider) that for any reason needs fiat today in exchange for what they do. (Google Ads, for example, does not accept payment in BTCZ!)

IMO, we should be sure to set the tax percentage correctly so that the Community Fund is well-endowed to pay members of both Groups A and B as necessary and desirable to get things done.

For that reason, we must consider the current value in Fiat of our daily/monthly accumulations when deciding upon an appropriate Community Fund fee percentage.

I’ve highlighted above $640/$19200 daily/monthly as a proposed minimum. I personally support an even higher option, but here is my point:

The real risk here is to do too little, not to do too much.

To those who are inclined to “go small”, I ask you please to think about whether the low option would really provide enough purchasing power to make the difference(s) we want to make with the Community Fund.

Consider costs of:

Design
Marketing
Advertising
Development
Infrastructure
Things not even yet forseen

and ask the questions “Are we up to the job today?” “Will we be up to the job tomorrow?”

and then come to your best-assessed conclusions.

Cheers!!